The best introduction ever
Using Cialdini's principles to up your game
Y’all, lemme tell you about Rob Thomas, a stud of a detective with the best interrogation introduction I have ever seen. Thomas was a police investigator in Toronto when Alek Minassian plowed a rented van into a crowd of people, killing 10 and injuring 16. Read about that here or here. Just 9 hours after Alek is taken into custody, Thomas walks in and delivers this performance. I cannot imagine the amount of pressure he would have been under to get this one right, and he nailed it. I, for one, will immediately shift to using intros based on this one. Let me tell you why.
Thomas uses Cialdini’s principles of persuasion combined with rapport based interviewing to engage with and motivate a person that many would have sneered at. There is never a single moment in this interview where Thomas is other than pleasant, but neither is there a single moment where it looks like Alek is running the show. Rather, Thomas methodically works him through the crime to a full confession.
In this article, we will start by watching Thomas’ introduction. Then, we will discuss why it is so effective, including a primer on Cialdini’s principles of persuasion. Lastly, I will provide a transcript of the introduction. If you are serious about interviewing suspects, I encourage you to study this introduction, and, if you’d like, watch the whole interview, which is available here.
The first thing that jumps out at me is that Thomas hands Alek a bottle of water, and then looks him in the eye, shakes his hand, and says, "You feeling okay? My name is Rob Thomas (shakes Alek’s hand) how are you? How are you? You doing ok?” Followed shortly by, “Yeah yeah well I can appreciate that. Alek - mind if I call you Alek?” and then, “Alek, my name’s Rob Thomas. I want you to call me Rob from here on in, okay?…Alek I want you to understand something. I’m a senior detective with the Toronto Police, you understand what that means?”
The very first thing that Thomas does is hand Alek a bottle of water. This is an example of Cialdini’s principle of Reciprocity. Basically, when we give people things, they want to give us things back. After a class recently, I was handed a challenge coin, I immediately felt an intense need to drop everything and give him a challenge coin back. It would be weird not to! You can generate this automatic response in people by handing them objects, but, maybe more importantly, by handing them intangible things like information or respect. I recommend that you get the ball rolling with a bottle of water or a business card and then continue the reciprocity with respect and sharing on your part too.
Michael Reddington writes about Cialdini’s principles in his book The Disciplined Listening Method. He writes, “For our purposes, one of the most effective ways to ethically leverage reciprocity is to share information and demonstrate vulnerability prior to asking your counterparts to do the same.”1 I was speaking to a witness to a child endangerment case recently. She told me about her addiction to drugs. I told her about my experience with family members that were addicted to drugs, and I included anecdotes specific to what somebody with that experience would know. This was an hour after the “rapport building phase” was done. Shortly afterwards, she told me everything about what she had seen, including a lot of details that she could have been expected to keep private (like her own drug use). When I was willing to share with her, she was willing to share with me.
Now, how about that handshake and introduction? “My name is Rob Thomas (shakes Alek’s hand) how are you?” It’s so simple that it feels revolutionary. Most of us introduce ourselves as “I’m Detective… with the ….Police Department.” Most introductions I see involve heading to the desk without looking at the subject, putting our stuff down, sighing, then just looking at them from 6 feet away. This is a cold reality shower right when we are best served by warmth. Thomas gets it right when he shakes Alek’s hand and uses his first and last name followed shortly after by his title. People who aren’t cops might not understand how ingrained it is in us to lead with the title and a wall of skeptical assessment. In this setting, we have to let it go.
Think about how you introduce yourself to subjects in the room, then contrast that with walking straight up to them, looking them in the eye, and introducing yourself by first and last name followed by “I’m a senior detective with the … Police Department.”
I think, as cops, we get used to being a little paranoid with our information. We hide behind Officer X or Detective Y because we don’t want to provide more information for people to type into Facebook. It occurred to me the other day, however, that I had gotten used to introducing myself by title and last name as an outcropping of a sort of standard issue standoffishness. I then realized that I avoided saying my first name while handing people my business card with my first name and email (which has my first name) and multiple phone numbers to call me and then later filing warrants with my first and last name all over them. I know I’m not the only one that does this. If they are going to know your name anyway, use it to your advantage to build some good will between the two of you.
Just after introducing himself the right way, Thomas creates his first social contract with Alek. He says, “Alek - mind if I call you Alek?” To which Alek, replies, “Yeah, sure.” This is related to Cialdini’s Consistency and Commitment principle. Basically (and I’m absolutely paraphrasing so read his work for definitive word on his ideas), humans want to appear consistent. If we take a stance, we want to follow through on it even if our thoughts might change. When we get somebody to commit to letting us call them a certain informal name, we are laying the groundwork for other, larger commitments (like talking about mass murder).
Then Thomas tells Alek that he is a “senior investigator for the Toronto Police Department.” This is a take on Cialdini’s principle of Authority. Basically, we tend to listen to people in authority and take them more seriously. By citing his own authority, he gets the benefit of it even while never being asked to prove or back it up. I was talking to one of the newer detectives in our unit this week, and I told her, “You are now a senior detective with the police department! I grant you the title.” The one caveat to this is that you must look serious, professional and prepared. If your actions say you’re a rookie, they’ll believe those more than your assertions.
Thomas goes on to create at least two more social contracts to build on his consistency progress with Alek. Namely: “First thing is, I ask that you treat with respect, okay? I promise to treat you with respect throughout the entire night okay? All I ask is you do the same for me. Is that okay?” This is so good. For a while now I’ve looked to include promises like this in my talks with suspects. “I promise I’ll get this right.” “You can trust me to get this right.” Promises as a word carries a lot of weight. Making promises like this can go a long way towards establishing consistency.
The next social contract is this: “…if you do decide to answer my questions, would you do me the favor and just speak from the heart, okay? And just be truthful. That’s all I ask. Does that sound fair?” Alek agrees to all of them, which creates a bedrock of consistency that should be easy to build on.
Finally, Thomas uses Cialdini’s concept of Social Proof when he says “Alek…I’ve been doing this a long time, okay? And I typically never have any problems for the people or anything like that. I don’t expect to have a problem with you today…”2 This is Thomas saying that everybody else voted to work with me (so my reviews are 5 stars favorable!).
Investigator Rob Thomas absolutely nails this interview and, particularly, the introduction. I hope that when my name is called to do the big interview that I’ll be as prepared as he was that day. If any of you know the man, I’d love to connect with him and chat.
I hope that you all are able to use these techniques in your interviews. Anybody who works around me will see that I’ll be using them. Even if you’re out on the street, what would it hurt you to say, “I’m Gary Chavez, a senior officer with the … Police Department.” If it’s an officer safety issue in your situation to be shaking hands, maybe a little wave and a friendly smile.
Thank you to the instructors at FLETC for turning me onto this video of Thomas and pointing out how Thomas was using Cialdini’s principles of persuasion. Thanks guys!
Here is a transcript of Rob Thomas’ introduction to Alek Minassian:
Alek?
Hello
Hi how are you?
I’m doing good. How are you?
Good good. Do you drink water?
Sure
(Hands him bottle of water) thanks so much How you feeling?
I’m good.
You feeling okay? My name is Rob Thomas (shakes Alek’s hand) how are you? How are you? You doing ok?
Yeah yeah.
Yeah, you probably have better days than this I guess eh?
Yeah I am a little shaken to be honest.
A little shaken
Like it’s not my usual day, obviously.
Yeah yeah well I can appreciate that. Alek - mind if I call you Alek?
Yeah sure.
Use it? What do your friends normally call you?
Alek.
Alek, my name’s Rob Thomas. I want you to call me Rob from here on in, okay?
Okay
Is that okay?
Ok
Alek I want you to understand something. I’m a senior detective with the Toronto Police, you understand what that means?
Uh, yes.
You know I’m a police officer?
Yes.
Okay. I don’t wear a uniform. I wear a suit and tie because of the type of work that I do. But although I’m in a suit and tie, I’m an actual police officer, okay? And I’m one of the senior investigators on this case. Okay? I got called in for this…this specific case because of what’s happened and the involvement and everything else that’s been going on, okay? Before we get started, I want you to know that we’re being videotaped and audio taped
Mmhmm
Okay? Do you know what I mean by that?
Yes, everything I say and do is being captured.
Exactly. Yeah on audio and video okay?
Yeah.
You know, here’s what I want to do Alek: I want to talk to you okay? We’re gonna spend a good deal of time together. Ok?
Ok.
It’s important that I talk to you aright? I’m gonna ask you questions okay? Gonna ask you questions about your background, your education, your relationships with your family and friends. Work, travel. And I’m gonna ask you questions about what happened today, okay? You don’t have to answer those questions if you don’t want, okay? You understand that?
Yes.
But if you do decide to answer my questions, okay, I just ask that you do two things for me, okay? First thing is, I ask that you treat with respect, okay? I promise to treat you with respect throughout the entire night okay? All I ask is you do the same for me. Is that okay?
Yes.
Okay and the other thing I ask, Alek, and I’ve been doing this a long time, okay? And I typically never have any problems for the people or anything like that. I don’t expect to have a problem with you today, but if you do decide to answer my questions, would you do me the favor and just speak from the heart, okay? And just be truthful. That’s all I ask. Does that sound fair?
Yes
Is that okay?
Yes.
(Begins interview)
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This is something J. Schanke (instructor of interrogation for FLETC) pointed out along with other uses of Cialdini during this introduction.